Talk:CEB Press/Manufacturing Instructions/Arms - primary

On my own initiative, I am attempting to assemble the Manufacturing Instructions for the CEB Press from the various materials on the wiki into one Open Office document, for eventual publishing as a full and complete .PDF (Adobe Acrobat document). I am not knowledgeable in machining, but I believe I have spotted some inconsistencies between the instructions and the diagrams and would appreciate help rectifying these.

Are the "Left" and "Right" diagrams intended to be the two primary arms with mirrored hole punches? If so, the models seem to be inconsistent with each other and the instructions. The "left" diagram shows only one hole punched on the 6" (vertical) side of the diagram whereas the "right" diagram shows five holes punched on the 6" side. The text instruction explicitly states, "The holes are all to be punched in the 4" side of the angle iron, in 1 1/4" from the edge of it." The holes on the 6" side are inconsistent with this, and one hole on each of the arms (on the 6" side) is 3 1/2" from the long edge and 2" from the short edge. The additional holes on the 6" side of the "right" model are 1 3/4" from the long edge. All holes on the 4" sides (on both arms) are centered 2" from the long edges.

I would greatly appreciate help rectifying this. I am capable of downloading the Sketchup models and altering them, but I'm not sure whether one of the two different models is correct (the "left" or "right" models as I described above and shown on the article page), or the text instructions are correct, as all three (the "left" model, the "right" model and the text) appear mutually inconsistent. This will most likely require someone actually at the Factor e Farm to confirm which (if any) are correct for the most recent iteration of the CEB Press Primary Arms.

This will probably be a slow process, going one step at a time through the various pieces, but it is necessary to get to a working draft. I greatly thank anyone at Factor e Farm who spots this and can help me ensure the manufacturing instructions are consistent and up to date with the latest version! --Howard V. Agnew 11:15, 20 September 2011 (CEST)


 * hey howard, i was afraid this might pop up. i was attempting to take the master sketchup model and make files with measurements on them. here is the original . thats the most recent model sketched on the farm. as i was measuring there were a few imbalances, one had a few holes 1.75 in vs the other side had 2 in. i took the liberty of tweaking it where i thought it was reasonable and prudent, before i put on the distance lines and such. i was planning on eventually doing each part and then assembling the entire model again from the measured files.


 * the extra unexplained holes are from the solenoid mount and controller box mount that were added before the new model was made.


 * as i was just testing out this idea, do you think its a good idea to go down this road or should we do something different? i like the pictures that were taken for the powerccube instructions. i thought this method would be nice if someone wanted to take it one part at a time and could download individual parts for less clutter etc. regardless i should have made a note about what i was doing. sorry about that.


 * --Dorkmo 01:34, 21 September 2011 (CEST)


 * a note too, each ceb hasn't been exactly the same until most recently this past few months they made 4. chris sketched the first of that series. ideally i'd liked to have had it come from the 4th, so little stuff was smoothed out. as this is the case, i thought i could do some house keeping as i went though it. --Dorkmo 01:53, 21 September 2011 (CEST)


 * Thank you for your time and effort on this. Going through piece by piece, we can see what's missing or inconsistent and get a coherent, complete set of blueprints and instructions together.  It will be so awesome for a first draft of a complete blueprint and instruction set so OSE machinist fans with the necessary skills and equipment can get started building their own CEB presses, putting them to work and better yet, making extra ones to sell and donating some of the profit back to funding Factor e Farm's road to developing the full GVCS!  --Howard V. Agnew 02:54, 21 September 2011 (CEST)

September 21, 2011 Update
Brianna has graciously offered to help me check through this information and will be sending me information. The printed steps in the article at the time I write this are definitely not current, and Brianna mentioned she thinks the placement of the holes in the sketchup drawings is not correct, either. Hopefully I can fix these remotely, at the same time getting the current correct information for the OpenOffice document I am working on. -hva


 * awesome sleuth work --Dorkmo 04:24, 22 September 2011 (CEST)


 * I do have new rough versions of the Sketchup drawings I sent to Brianna for review. The holes have been changed, and the thickness of the anglebrackets is 1/2", not 1/4" as was previously specified (I think the existing google sketchups and the completed model both have 1/4" thickness on the angle brackets instead of 1/2").  I should peek back at the Bill of Materials too.  --Howard V. Agnew 09:34, 22 September 2011 (CEST)

"From the edge"
when we say from the edge of the angle iron, are we talking from the center of the hole or to the edge of the hole? --Dorkmo 07:01, 23 September 2011 (CEST)


 * I already created new sketchup models to match the new specs, working with Brianna. When she confirms my latest edits to those models, I will go through and clean up the article text.  I am working some new principles between the diagrams and the text, to get them to match one another.  For instance, I ran into the same problem you did (assuming you did the sketchup models currently displayed) of the dimensionals creating a lot of clutter if all done from the left side edge (which is how the directions read) because of how long yet narrow the part is.  When I revise the text, I will include with the hole placements described in the text the dimensions as they appear in the diagram (about half coming from the right side) in parentheticals.  Also, in the dimensionals I did in Sketchup, to match the text I converted all measurements to pure inches (instead of feet-inches); Brianna indicated this is standard for machinists and what they are comfortable with, so the sketchup model will match the pure-inches text.  All you have to do on the dimensionals is click on them, right click and choose 'edit text' to change the text that is displayed, manually figure out a feet-inches to just-inches conversion, and type that in ... I don't know if there's an automatic option somewhere in Sketchup to make the dimensionals show just inches by default or not (instead of feet-inches).
 * The sketchup models are being used for the word processing document I am putting together that will have the complete set of instructions, manufacturing instructions for every part, for the assembly process, for the machine programming and testing.
 * I don't know if you also did the sketchup model of the main, completed machine, but it will need to be updated as well (the thickness of the primary arms is incorrect; I think when I checked, it was only 1/4" on the completed model, and of course the holes and bolt locations will change). Some of the holes that are to be made on the primary arms, I guess are torched in later after the part is attached, which is why the left side no longer shows hole at the "build this part" stage of the instructions.
 * I think I may probably have you do most or at least part of the sketchup work, but the dimensions for all the parts need to be verified against the current builds with Brianna. --Howard V. Agnew 09:21, 23 September 2011 (CEST)

Re: Documentation overhaul
This was the first part overhauled and been verified with the current builders as being up to date and complete. The CAD drawings will be updated to match shortly, if they have not already been. --Howard V. Agnew 03:34, 24 September 2011 (CEST)